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· Gone but Never Forgotten
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Jim
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It's been said that religion, as good a thing as it is supposed to be, is the major cause of most wars. It certainly causes strife when a religiously divided people clash.

I admire people that want to leave behind a less than perfect homeland and make a new life in Canada but I and thoroughly pissed off at groups that bring their troubles and antiquated, backward and discriminatroy religions with them, cry out "freedom of religion" then use those "rights" to bypass and usurp Canadian law! Read the following quotes from a CBC article:

...my friend got a rude awakening when her father's inheritance was handed out and she found that everything – the business, the jewelry, the money and all the family assets – had been distributed to her younger brother. She got nothing. Why? Because under certain interpretations of Shariah law, men are entitled to more inheritance then their sisters or wives.
...In 1991, an amendment was made to Ontario's Arbitration Act, allowing parties to settle disputes outside the courts...
a small group of Muslims in Toronto has set up a Shariah arbitration court where the arbiters will make judgments on civil matters such as divorce, inheritance and child custody.
These supposed arbiters of justice in the Shariah court – what qualifications do these men have to make decisions on legal matters in Canada? Absolutely none. This is a self-appointed House of Lords. They don't need to know the law, they don't need to know the rules, hell, they may not even need to know the Qur'an, because they are accountable to no one.
There is no formal system through which you can challenge religious clerics, the masters of the Shariah universe. And if you do challenge them, get ready to be called a blasphemer.
Read the full article here
I'm sick and tired of distasteful cultural practices and dogma being disguised, and defended as "freedom of religion". And I consider allowing those cultural practices to take precedent over the laws of the land to be a dangerous precedent. :mad:
 

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and.... not only with religion..... what about here in Texas,( which is a part of the United States,! ) they are putting up street signs in.... SPANISH....! they are filling up the grocery store shelves with items from .... MEXICO...! which is written in ...SPANISH...! they even speak.....SPANISH....! over the loud speaker at Walmart and other stores. I am sorry, but I don't speak.... SPANISH....! I speak...ENGLISH...! which IS the national language of America. When I went to Germany I had to learn some German in order to get around and even to order something to eat!
Why are we turning over backwards to accomodate people that cross our borders!!?? and if you say anything to them about it.....they hollar PREJUDICE...!
...............well I publically got that off my chest!!!.........
 

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bassetman said:
Religious "nuts" in this country use their Freedom to practice their religon and to try to shove it down everyone else's throat too! :rolleyes:
ROFLMAO!

Yeah...

Valley should be popping into this thread at any time now!

:D :D :D :D :D
 

· Gone but Never Forgotten
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Jim
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I can appreciate your frustration over language as that is also a hinderance here wherein many immigrants never learn English. This causes great difficulty in dealing with them in public and governemnt spend huge amounts of money on having to hire and train people to speak a multitude of languages. They even provide free translators for people that don't speak English.

But despite the Language problem, I am not really concerned with it and I welcome any and all ethnic foods! I love variety and will try anything. My main point in this thread was to expose the protecting of outmoded and often illegal cultural practices by disguising them as religious to circumvent the law.
 

· Gone but Never Forgotten
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Jim
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
ROFLMAO!

Yeah...

Valley should be popping into this thread at any time now!
Oops! I hadn't thought about that! I'm in deep do-do now! :eek:
 

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Join the club for religious and cultural outcasts Jim, I've been keeping your seat warm! :D :D :D
 

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ehmamajo said:
and.... not only with religion..... what about here in Texas,( which is a part of the United States,! ) they are putting up street signs in.... SPANISH....! they are filling up the grocery store shelves with items from .... MEXICO...! which is written in ...SPANISH...! they even speak.....SPANISH....! over the loud speaker at Walmart and other stores. I am sorry, but I don't speak.... SPANISH....! I speak...ENGLISH...! which IS the national language of America. When I went to Germany I had to learn some German in order to get around and even to order something to eat!
Why are we turning over backwards to accomodate people that cross our borders!!?? and if you say anything to them about it.....they hollar PREJUDICE...!
...............well I publically got that off my chest!!!.........
there is no "national language" in the United States. Ever. By Law. Your post is nothing but a veiled racist attack and shows your xenophobia. As a Hispanic that was born here, that doesn't speak Spanish, I must tell you that I work with LEP (limited english proficient) people everyday, and they DO want to learn English. however, why would you get mad at Wal-Mart, or any other business that conducts THEIR business in Spanish. By 2010, Hispanic buying power is predicted to be over 700 Billion dollars a year.
And really, lets be practical, realistic, and truthful. If it wasn't for AMerican businesses taking advantage of immigrants (paying them lower wages, or not paying them at all) the US economy would come to a grinding halt.
:mad: :mad: :down:
p.s. your statement wasn't prejudicial, it was ignorant.
 

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SexyTech said:
ROFLMAO!

Yeah...

Valley should be popping into this thread at any time now!

:D :D :D :D :D
you snot. I was reading along my merrily way until I scrolled down to this post! :p

and I agree with Jim that the sharia laws are outrageous. The should all convert to Christianity, imo. ;)
 

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infidel_kast said:
there is no "national language" in the United States. Ever. By Law. Your post is nothing but a veiled racist attack and shows your xenophobia. As a Hispanic that was born here, that doesn't speak Spanish, I must tell you that I work with LEP (limited english proficient) people everyday, and they DO want to learn English. however, why would you get mad at Wal-Mart, or any other business that conducts THEIR business in Spanish. By 2010, Hispanic buying power is predicted to be over 700 Billion dollars a year.
And really, lets be practical, realistic, and truthful. If it wasn't for AMerican businesses taking advantage of immigrants (paying them lower wages, or not paying them at all) the US economy would come to a grinding halt.
:mad: :mad: :down:
p.s. your statement wasn't prejudicial, it was ignorant.
You know dang well that your opinion isn't humble! ;)
 

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barfly said:
Oldie,as usual your gentle touch goes straight for the throat :D :up:
Hi old chum :D

Well, my good wife and myself have visited the States many times over the years. Only once did we encounter the Queens English, and that was amongst the Californy gendre benders :D My my were they game for a laugh :D

oldie :up:
 

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Jim
Keeping on the original subject matter and not the language barrier problem I agree with your argument up to a certain point. I agree that immigrants to a different culture\laws must abide by those laws. If the laws are contradictory to their religion or cultural upbringing then those laws should be looked at by the legislature for possible change and once decided on should be honored. I personally may disagree with some of the changes and as a matter of fact I do, but I still have to abide by them. There are many instances of this activity going on right now in the US as I am sure around the World. Several come to mind that happened in the US.

1) The Islamic Woman in Florida that refused to have her picture taken for a drivers license without her veil covering her face. This fight is still going on and has spread to other States. Drivers License and Veil
2) A young girl was sent home several times from school and finally suspended from school because she was required by her religion to wear head covering. Not a veil just head covering. (Cannot locate article)
3) Several criminals accused of robbery had their cases dismissed because they were not provided an approved interpreter at the time of arrest for reading of there Miranda rights. (Sorry Language Barrier)
4) Remaining Blue laws from years ago that prevented retail sales on Sunday. Some of these laws are still in effect in some States, RE: Selling cars at a Dealership on Sunday. Just one example

Unfortunately there is no easy answer when Church\Religion and State come into conflict. One can only use a sensitivity factor weighed against the rights of all peoples to make the final decision. No matter what is decided in these matters someone is going to protest!

Dave
 

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My two pennies worth. For what it's worth :)

I am a "Non conformist Christian" I respect any and all religions that teach good. I abhor any religion that teaches evil.

I fully condone and admire the beliefs that Valley lives by.

I also hold "Buddhism" in high regard. It's respect for All forms of life.

My charity work with Asylum seekers means I become involved with many Muslims, the majority of whom are very gentle and humble :) Only yesterday another group of sad humans reach Malta's shores .. http://www.timesofmalta.com/core2/article.php?id=151134

Thanks to you guys of the USA 6th fleet :up: Well done :up:

Oldie
 

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Davey, your view of tolerance as a nation, though admirable, is one destined to disaster. In accomodating over and over each and every new viewpoint into your laws you are inevitably widening and widening the circle of permitted behaviour. Ultimately the system becomes so tolerant that each new transgressor has only to argue that his act was part of his religion. How would you accomodate the situation where a person of one religion argues to be allowed to behave in one way, and another person from another religion argues for permission to behave the direct converse when both are mutually exclusive, both on religious grounds?

Laws should reflect a working solution to imposing the philosophy and ethic of a society, not a means for all to be allowed anything they want. That is unworkable.
 

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ehmamajo said:
and.... not only with religion..... what about here in Texas,( which is a part of the United States,! ) they are putting up street signs in.... SPANISH....! they are filling up the grocery store shelves with items from .... MEXICO...! which is written in ...SPANISH...! they even speak.....SPANISH....! over the loud speaker at Walmart and other stores. I am sorry, but I don't speak.... SPANISH....! I speak...ENGLISH...! which IS the national language of America. When I went to Germany I had to learn some German in order to get around and even to order something to eat!
Why are we turning over backwards to accomodate people that cross our borders!!?? and if you say anything to them about it.....they hollar PREJUDICE...!
...............well I publically got that off my chest!!!.........
I do freelance interpretation for many businesses and government agencies, if everyone spoke English that would definately affect my own economy. I taught myself a second language well enough to do this and am working on a third. It's fun learning a new language, and meeting people who speak the language you are learning helps you to learn and converse in that language.

I agree Val!! :D
 

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Albert
I agree uncontrolled change would be disaster however I am not speaking of uncontrolled change and tolerance. What I am referring too is religious customs and beliefs that are well documented through-out their culture such as the wearing of a head-dress. The particular school district that prevented this young lady from entering school with the head-dress had a rule that said any head gear was unacceptable due to concerns of gang affiliation and display of colors. Clearly this was not a gang affiliation but the zero tolerance rule that left little for historical significance of the head-dress.
However....
Wearing of a veil undermines the reason for having photos on drivers licenses which is for identification purposes. Safety issues presented especially after 9-11 brought this issue to light. A person stopped by police for any matter could not be identified as the actual individual presenting the license. I understand there are extraordinary forgeries available which would circumvent positive identification but hopefully those are the exception.

Dave
 

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Well I'm not sick and fed up with my own personal religion....but in the article following the people go a bit too far! :rolleyes: Take care. angel

Filipino Christians Nailed To Cross In Bloody Ritual

POSTED: 7:48 a.m. EDT April 9, 2004

SAN PEDRO CUTID, Philippines -- Dozens of men and at least three women were re-enacting the crucifixion of Jesus Christ in the Philippines Friday -- even though a recent movie has some of them a bit on edge.

They're observing Good Friday, even though religious leaders oppose the bloody annual ritual.

The Roman Catholic participants had their palms and feet nailed to a cross with four-inch nails. They did so as a form of penance for sins, to pray for a sick relative or to fulfill a vow.

Mel Gibson's film "The Passion of the Christ" seemed to have some impact on the event.

Some devotees said they got nervous about doing the re-enactment after watching the bloody scenes in the movie. Also, more people than usual showed up to watch the event.
 

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How awful! That Christ willingly bore those nails ought to be enough for them. To copy it in an effort to atone for personal sin is like saying that Jesus' own crucifixion was not enough...that you have to do more more more to win God's favor! God is no respecter of people! All He requires is personal repentence and a belief that Christ was crucified and ressurected.

What they do takes away from the fact that salvation is all of grace and not something you earn by performing these kinds of works! :(
 
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