Huh....?

As me ma use ta say . . . "open mouth, insert foot"

I am in no way supporting the Mouldy one, mainly because that is the stance I take with him on any issue, however, you definitely jumped before looking into this one.

That's about as silly a stance to take as opposing the US for bullying a poor defenseless country like Germany and Japan back in the 40's!!! You can make a point out of it, if you take it out of context of WWII.

Luckily, due to the fact that this site is as good as it, I know their will be no hard feelings by anyone here, including his Mouldiness!!


I, and others I have seen post about the attacks we received, would have dealt a lot more harshly than Mouldy did. As a matter of fact, several NEW accounts were closed by Mike, so I suppose you could say he was acting in a dictatorial capacity, huh??

Anyway, welcome back, and just be glad you weren't around, cause if Mouldy's statement was enough to make you post this, you probably would have flipped at the people that Mouldy's statement was directed towards.

Not so much foot-in-mouth, as miss-the-point.

But, glad it gave everyone so much fun to make fun of my personal beliefs and feelings.

As I said, I didn't read the posts. I just skimmed over a few pages now, and saw mainly people from TSG making fun of and saying mean stuff about the Italion posters.

My take on it from this is, maybe they did it just to see how people in the USA (and other countries who post here) are, and would take it?

Maybe they did it in fun? Like poking a stick in an ant hill and watching the ants react to it. (note: if nobody here had REACTED to it, it would have stopped right then. Not so hard to write around threads and not tie in with it?)

Maybe it's simply a cultural difference? NOt understanding each other. I'm sure they have gone away with a not very positive picture of how "people on the English speaking forum" reacted to them.

Maybe they were just trying to get to know people here in their own way? Or see if there was censorship and control here, as apparently there is on their forum. "America, land of the free" and all?

Anyway, that wasn't my point at all. Which didn't seem to matter and probably doesn't know.

I responded to Muldor's post, which "strongly suggested" we not write to the Italions anymore because he was unable to censor what was written in Italion. Gee, someone might say something he wouldn't like if he could understand it?

Then, he said the thread was closed. I don't know if he meant the one with the Italions, which would have been fine with me, and I didn't bother going back that far to find out.

The other point I objected to was him stating this, and closing THAT thread, with only his post on it. Like, I have spoken and if anyone has anything to say about it, or feels differently about it, too bad.

I did come across the name of the Italion website, and finally tracked down the name of it (from a subject line) because the website had been "censored" out.

To sum it up, I, personally resent not being allowed to make my own choices in who I write to and/or respond to. Having this right taken away from me. And yes, I know it's not MY board, so I actually have no "rights" on it, except what the moderators give me and allow. I can be deleted and banned from the board for saying how I honestly think and feel.

And, the idea of someone giving an order (in the guise of "strong suggestion) and then putting THREAD CLOSED on it, to discourage anyone who might not agree.

I'm not in favor of abusive, threatening, of for that matter
post that make fun of someone for their personal feelings and beliefs . But I don't feel the right to decide this (and what it might be to each person) should be taken away from us.

Who knows, it might have been an opportunity to show the Italions what we're really like? Not bothered by "words on a discussion board" even in foreign languages. It could have been a chance to practice "just ignoring" what we might not like. It could have been something to have FUN with, for that matter.

But, someone else deciding what it should be takes all the choices and possibilities out of it.

Well, I guess it doesn't take away the choice to not be subject to someone who takes the choices and possibilities away from us.

Anyway, what the Italions wrote and why (or why it was decided they did) didn't have anything to do with my post. I knew I hadn't read the posts and I knew I didn't have to, to feel the way I do about being ruled, controled, censored and having my choices taken away from me.

And before anyone says "well, you don't know what it's like, you don't have a discussion board to deal with this stuff" I do have and have had discussion boards (totally fee and unmoderated) for around 3 years. I wouldn't want to set myself up to decide what should/shouldn't be allowed on it.

I know, this also includes Muldor and his "rulings".

Which would have been less controlling if he hadn't made it and then closed the thread. And, if he didn't have the power to delete what I write in response to it.

Doesn't fit with my idea of "discussion".

And I know, if I don't like it here I can go elsewhere... where there is no censorship and control, and no "moderators" watching over us to keep us safe.

There actually are boards and groups like that. And you know, they are a lot "safer" to be on than ones like this.

~ Carrie

~ Carrie

Hi Carrie:

"But, glad it gave everyone so much fun to make fun of my personal beliefs and feelings. "


No- Not me. I wasn't going to offer any input till I saw your post.

I don't hold Mulder responsible for what occured here.
-----------
"My take on it from this is, maybe they did it just to see how people in the USA (and other countries who post here) are, and would take it?

Maybe they did it in fun? Like poking a stick in an ant hill and watching the ants react to it. (note: if nobody here had REACTED to it, it would have stopped right then. Not so hard to write around threads and not tie in with it?)

Maybe it's simply a cultural difference? NOt understanding each other. I'm sure they have gone away with a not very positive picture of how "people on the English speaking forum" reacted to them.

Maybe they were just trying to get to know people here in their own way? Or see if there was censorship and control here, as apparently there is on their forum. "America, land of the free" and all? "
---------
I agree.

--------------
"I responded to Muldor's post, which "strongly suggested" we not write to the Italions anymore because he was unable to censor what was written in Italion. Gee, someone might say something he wouldn't like if he could understand it?

Then, he said the thread was closed. I don't know if he meant the one with the Italions, which would have been fine with me, and I didn't bother going back that far to find out.

The other point I objected to was him stating this, and closing THAT thread, with only his post on it. Like, I have spoken and if anyone has anything to say about it, or feels differently about it, too bad. "

-----------------

It was the timing of all posts and the response that Mulder had to make that was important.I followed most of it but didn't participate. The whole of the situation is as bad as you have seen, but the time line did put Mulder's actions in a different aspect than if you look back at the end result. It's difficult to see now with all the posts and bumps. Here and in Italy.



In another thread I complained(strongly) about the abusive power of words and realize I'm not too popular for it. I wouldn't change a thing.
This site has just realized the power of lack of understanding. Canadian-Italian-American
The Google translator doesn't help me very much at that Italian site, but I can tell there is as much disrespect there of 'us' as there is here of 'them'.


------------------

"Ah heck, you've kinda stuck yer foot in yer mouth sweetie. "
"How about I just laugh and point my finger and say, "Aw carrie don't ya feel funny with those feet of your's sticking out your cheeks?"

--------------------

I disagree.

Sorry Starchild, but simply put ,you are wrong.
Instead of admitting it , you choose to argue the point !

I like to kid and harass Mulder,and others also, but I have been here a long time, most people know my "style"

To say...

"And I know, if I don't like it here I can go elsewhere... where there is no censorship and control, and no "moderators" watching over us to keep us safe. "

... is flighty at best, I to have been to those boards, where every third word is a curse word and no such thing as respect is known.

You are TOTALLY wrong to say "the idea of someone giving an order (in the guise of "strong suggestion) and then putting THREAD CLOSED on it, to discourage anyone who might not agree...

..You did respond, and made your point as I am !

I would think it over carefully... have you learned anything here? Do you feel "controlled" here...I think not...I think three small words would have done the job.."oops I Goofed" !...Rhett

Well, actually, this is mainly my fault because I should have explained myself in that post better. I went back and edited it to add a comment for that purpose.

I can see how someone could easily make the mistake Carrie made and I am still not sure she understands exactly what happened as most of the rest of us do.

Trust me Carrie, the thread was closed not because I did not want to discuss the topic but because I knew that the Italian posters who had attacked the board would have immediately begun posting in the thread I created, but I also didn't want to say anything really negative about them. I wanted the matter to blow over as quickly as possible by ignoring them, which was the reason for my post. I couldn't tell anyone not to post, so I strongly advised it because it would be difficult for us to censor posts simply because someone was speaking in broken English. I couldn't think of any other way to handle it.

As far as an entire post in another language, the problem is translators do not translate well, especially offensive slang, which would be exactly what we would want to censor. However, we do not plan on closing foreign language threads unless it becomes a problem (or unless the same perpetrators return). This appears to be an isolated occurrence by a few renegades who happen to speak Italian, but it could have been any other language. The only reason I could come up with as justification to close the posts while the attack was going on was that I could not understand the threads to moderate them (i.e., to determine if any rules were being broken). But honestly, I have no problem with foreign language threads as long as it doesn't become too difficult for us to moderate.

Sorry if this caused you concern, but I had to do something and that was the best I could come up with at the time. Although on reflection now, I would have added an explanatory comment as I have done. I'll give it another few days and then "Unstick" the comment.

PS--I don't mind Carrie challenging my authority because it makes me feel really important!!!

*Kath jumps in with both feet* ...

Ok Carrie ... Imma try and paint a picture for you, since your eyes didn't get to witness the "shock" that many, many members eyes did. 'Ere goes...

Normal scenario for we random addicts is that we click on our favs, or whatever, and BAM! We land on the first page of our beloved TSG Random. Tada! Therein lies all of the familiar threads, correct? Wellllllllllllllll, a few evenings ago, as we all logged into Random, within minutes of each other (I presume), because the list of member names at the top of my Random page numbered close to 50, which was more members than I had ever seen in here at any given time *takes a breath* ...
Ok Carrie, now get this ... there was NOT ONE thread left on the first page of Random, that belonged to ANY of us. We had been hijacked by the Italians. Have you wondered why? Does the name "Pavoratti" mean anything to you? In the event that it doesn't, let me shed a bit of light on it for you. Pavoratti was an Italian member that kept violating the TSG rules, and finally after many warnings from the forums Moderators, and Administrators, Pavorattis' account was disabled. Well this obviously enraged the Italian cohorts of Pavoratti, so they all came here, registered user names, and totally wiped out the first page of Random with threads that made no sense. This was a planned attack on TSG, I have a link to another forum that I'd be happy to share with you via PM, as proof, if you'd like. (By the way, THAT forum was also hijacked by them, wherein the Administrator there had to give them their own forum)
As for Mulder, and your angered attack on him... since you weren't here, and didn't witness what WE did, I offer you a bit of empathy, however, on the other side of that coin, I feel as though you owe him an apology, a public one at that (since you publicly attacked him). What Mulder did, was the BEST way to get the members attention ALL AT ONCE... catch my drift? He certainly didn't intend on slamming the door in anyones face by closing the thread that HE created for information purposes... he merely closed it after alerting the members as to what the TSG Bosses felt appropriate. Look at it like a "This is a test of the emergency broadcasting system" that we hear on our televisions... make sense?
In closing, I can't help but wonder what you would have thought had you have come to Random that night and witnessed what we did...

'Nuff Said...
Kath